2nd Edition Review Thread

[geneb]

Here's the current draft (incomplete)

http://www.geneb.org/rostock-max/Rostoc ... -Guide.pdf

I've got my flame proof underwear on, so have at!

g.

[JohnStack]

I went through it. It rocks. Even the color!

I can review in bite sized pieces so much easier than the whole shooting match.

I guess I'll never convince anyone to put the power supply in first.

Really nice job, would be happy to read the next.

[geneb]

Thanks John. The color was done to ensure folks that this was a complete, from the ground-up rewrite. (that and it looks neat!)

The problem I have with putting the power supply in first is that it could cause an issue when you need to replace the power supply or upgrade it.
I really like the suggestion that it use a pair of diagonally set socket head screws instead of the nylon.

g.

[Jimustanguitar]

I read through it too, looks great so far. I wish I assembled mine in this order

[mechneering]

Looking good Geneb. I actually really like the color

[geneb]

Ok guys, the draft is updated - it covers the main mechanical assembly so far. Did I miss anything? Is it unclear in places?

cambo3d, stick your oar in here! Considering SeeMeCNC sent me all the updated parts for free, this manual is about as official and SeeMeCNC sanctioned as it's gonna get.

g.

[itilguru]

This is dramatically improved. Please add a section on how to identify parts. I had a lot of trouble figuring out what #6-32 screws were until I spent an hour on Google and found some pictures.

I also recommend you put the end stop wiring in before you put the towers on. Use a loose knot or tape to hold it in place. You can drill out the tiny slot on the top to make room for the wire ends if needed. That may violate the spirit of the rules though.

[geneb]

Considering what I got when giving Google "what is a #6-32 screw", I don't buy the "hour" bit at all.

Running the end stop wiring without the upper idler pulley in place is just as easy as it would be if threading it through there with the bare extrusion sitting on a table in front of you. You'd actually run a non-zero risk of doing damage to the wires if you were to have them on the extrusion before it was installed.

The latest draft is up - it's 70 pages and covers up to installing the belts. I included belt path diagrams that *I* think are pretty clear, but you guys may think otherwise.

g.

[dbarrans]

Gene, I tried your way to install the belts using forceps but still had a devil of a time pulling the belt through the hole in the carriage. I suggested an alternate approach in my sorta-build thread (http://forum.seemecnc.com/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=1590) that works for me in seconds. I think it's worth a look and a mention.

- dan

[Batteau62]

I did a similar trick to dbarrans. I used a thin metal ruler I have in place of the plastic. I also rolled the end of the belt so it had a little curve in the direction of the slot in the carriage. If you push the thin "ramp" of material to the back of the slot in the extrusion, and push the belt in from the top, it will slip through with no problem. It really does work very well.

[geneb]

Noted, thanks guys.

dbarrans, do you mind if I use your description & photo verbatim?

tnx.

g.

[dbarrans]

I don't mind at all.

- dan

[Durandal]

Honestly I'm not sure if it's necessary with the molded bearing covers, but it doesn't mention cleaning the mold flash from the bearing covers in 7.1. Considering that the contact surface is presumably much cleaner than it was with the machined versions, it might not be, but I did cut off a large ring of flash off of both the top and bottom of each cover on my molded ones. Also, did they not send you the updated bearing covers with all the other updated parts?

As for identifying hardware, that's really on SeeMeCNC, labels on the little bags would help a lot, but even shipping an up to date BOM with the kit would help people figure out what goes where.

[geneb]

I didn't get a new set of bearing covers. I pulled all mine apart and put 'em back together again for the photos.

I can certainly mention the molding flash in the current instructions.

The draft is currently at 80 pages and covers up to and including the extruder bracket. The link is at the top of the thread. Please folks, take a look at it and let me know if I'm forgetting something or a point could be made more clear.

Last night I got the power supply installed and the RAMBo mounted. The new hot end wiring instructions will include details on using JST connectors for the hot end thermistor and a high capacity connector pair for the hot end power lines. I'll also show installing a 25mm PEEK fan.

g.

[foshon]

Gene,

Do you think it would make sense to include links to some of the calibration guides on here, or the fella that blogged it? While your calibration guide was perfectly clear and easy to follow for me, not everyone learns the same way. I also wonder if it would be helpful to include links to Poly's extruder calibration guide. IMHO, after mech's are sorted a well calibrated extruder is all one needs to at least lay down some plastic. If you've already sorted all this out please disregard. The new manual isn't up to calibration yet and I'm far too lazy to download the other again.

[geneb]

My intention is to completely re-write the calibration section and I intend to do a video very much like this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmP9JQPAlr4 but cover points specific to the Rostock MAX. I'm also going to go into detail showing how to calibrate the e-steps using a method someone here mentioned (you?) - take a length of filament, put marks 100mm apart and use that to calibrate the extruder drive. I'm not going to update the Steve's Extruder assembly documentation, but will feature the EZStruder instead. I'll copy/paste the information for the Steve's into the beginning of the section on dealing with the extruder.

I assembled the EZStruder last night and it's so easy and straightforward to assemble, even Matt couldn't screw it up.

g.

[foshon]

I have used that method, but it is not mine. I think Richrap or TriffidHunter came up with it originally, but Jim is the one that brought here. I think you may be giving Matt to much credit. Who is Matt?

[geneb]

Matt is the guy from NZ that should only be allowed near tools marked "Fischer-Price". He did the YT smear videos of his Rostock MAX "experience".

g.

[foshon]

ahh that douche.

[geneb]

New draft posted, same link. Among other goodies, the instructions for the EZStruder are in this one.

The next sections will cover the power supply, RAMBo mount, Onyx install and the hot end assembly & wiring.

g.

[geneb]

Next draft posted, link is in the first post of the thread - but you knew that, right?

We're nearing the end of the assembly process. It's up to 15 sections, 114 pages and 201 photos. The current draft takes you right up to mounting the hot end.
The next section will cover hooking up all the wiring.

g.

[geneb]

Ok guys, the manual is complete with regard to assembly & wiring. I'll be adding the software configuration & calibration sections soon.
131 pages.

The Orange Menace!

[img]http://www.geneb.org/rostock-max/geneb- ... menace.jpg[/img]

g.

[foshon]

I love that shirt!!!

[kbob]

Hi, Gene.

This manual is looking good. I just read the whole thing, and I can pretty well visualize what has to happen most of the time. (I haven't started building my printer yet.)

Nonetheless, I have just a few comments. These apply to version 1.01, May 26th.

I'm not going to build my printer at home, so I paid special attention to what tools and materials are required. I may have gone overboard on calling out the tools in use. (A pencil? Really‽)

• Errata
• pp 2-4. Could you divide these into necessary and optional sections? It would be nice to have tools separate from materials, too.
• pp 2-5. Add 6-32 tap as an optional tool? I plan to use one for the hole in the CheapSkate that holds the limit switch contacting bolt.
• P. 3, para 4. The split flex tubing is never mentioned again. What's it for? (I searched for each of the words, split, flex, tubing, and tube. I did not find it.)
• P. 3, para 7 and other places. The wooden yardstick can be any disposable, cuttable, rigid stick 30" long or so. Wooden yardsticks are getting hard to find.
• P. 4. It says that we need Dean's or XT60 connectors for the hot end. In fact, we need them both for the hot end and for the heated bed. It would be unfortunate to have ordered a single pair. (-:
  Also, could you please give the required amperage for each? The hot end needs 2 amps, so alternatives such as Molex or JST would work. I'm not sure about the bed heater.
• P. 7, para 2. Mentions a github repository, but there is no URL for it anywhere in the document.
• Chapter 2 (Base Assembly). I can not find any place where the axes are explained. You should explain that there are three axes, they're called X, Y and Z, and that X is at the front left, Y at the front right, and Z at the back. A diagram would be great, maybe overlaid on a photo of the base plate. Page 11 looks like the right place to add that info.
• P. 11, para 1. "You don't want to install the `shoes' until the end of the build" should be "You don't want to install the `shoes' until the base is assembled."
• P. 18, para 2. "working with earlier this Tri-Support assembly" should be "working with earlier ONTO this Tri-Support assembly".
• P. 19, para 2 "the two idler assembly" should be "the two idler assemblies".
• P. 20, para 4. "like with the flat head screws" should be "as with the flat head screws".
• P. 30, para 2. You mentioned a power screwdriver. In Steve's assembly video, he highly recommends a power driver. He said he sets the clutch to "2", whatever that means on any given screwdriver. You should suggest a power screwdriver in the parts and materials list.
• P. 33, para 1. You say, "install four fastener pairs". It's possible to misconstrue that as four facing pairs of T-slot nuts. I suggest you say "install four nuts with four screws".
• P. 34, para 1. Which tower extrusion do you install first? If it doesn't matter, please say so.
• P. 37, paras 1 and 3. Is it an Idler Mount or an Idler Bracket?
• P. 37, para 3. The pencil is not in the tools and materials list.
• P. 38, para 2. "at the exact height as all the rest" should be "at the exact SAME height as all the rest".
• P. 39, paras 2-3. Do you want me to take the Idler Mount/Bracket off the extrusion now? (-:
• P. 42, para 2. "more difficult that it needs to be" should be "more difficult THAN it needs to be".
• P. 45, para 2. We also need to ensure that the towers are the same distance apart at the top as at the base. It reads to me as though it would be okay if each leg had a 2mm gap at the bottom and a 1mm gap at the top.
• P. 46, para 4. Fishing line is not in the tools and materials list.
• P. 49, para 3. Extra punctuation!.!.!.(???)
• P. 50, para 2. Why is the screw head on the inside? If it were on the outside, you could use an ordinary screwdriver instead of forceps and a wrench to hold the nut. Screw head on the outside would also look a litle cleaner. I have not done this yet, so maybe I'm missing something.
• P. 56, para 2. I do not understand this. Do the #4 machine screws go into nuts? If not, do they self-tap the holes? Why aren't they wood screws if they go into an unthreaded hold? (I have not seen the parts yet. Maybe it will become clear when I do.) (Update. The top photo on page 58 make it clear: the screws do not go all the way through, and there are no nuts.)
• P. 62, para 3. Two 7/16" open end wrenches are not in the tools and materials list. A 5/16" wrench is listed but not used. Is one of those a typo?
• P. 63, para 2. "bit to large" should be "bit too large".
• P. 72, para 1, also page 124, para 2. "end-stop" should be "end stop". You use the unhyphenated form everywhere else. (Technically, they're limit switches, not end stops, but I'm trying not to feed my inner pedant.)
• P 63, para 2. "want a fight that's snug" should be "want a FIT that's snug".
• P 63, para 2. Shouldn't we check the fit before assembling the carriage? Also, I won't know until page 65 what the Axle Supports should fit into.
• Chapter 10 (Delta Arms). Which side of the Effector Platform is the top?
• P. 88, para 5. Neither heat shrink tubing nor electrician's tape is in the parts and materials list.
• P. 95, Fig. 13-7. Please use a close-up of the connector. Something like this (only less pixelated) would show the needed detail.
  

  

  Fig. 13-7: RAMBo power terminal wirign completed.

• P. 97. Did you want to list the part number for melamine bed mounting plate?
• P. 102 calls for six small nails. Not in the tools and materials list.
• P. 104, para 3. "PFTE" shoule be "PTFE".
• Chapter 16 (Wiring). I would like to see a diagram right up front (or a photo, but the photos are messier because of all the wires) showing the RAMBo with ALL of the connections we'll be using labeled. As it is, one has to skim the whole chapter to find out what all needs connecting. I'm afraid I'll miss something. Polarity would be helpful, too.
• P. 114, para 3. Slip-joint pliers are not in the tools and materials list.
• P. 116, para 3. Mentions a github repository and an archive file, but there is no URL for either one anywhere in the document. (Same as page 7.)
• P. 119, para 2. "clip the wire to the bowden tube". I have not seen anything about installing the Bowden tube. When should it be installed? How should it be routed?
• P. 123, para 4. Drill and 1/16" bit are not in the tools and materials list.
• P. 124, para 4. Suggests a countersink. A countersink is not in the tools and materials list.
• P 124, Fig 16-20. Did you use a Sharpie? A Sharpie is not in the tools and materials list.

And I just love the orange. It's a good shade.

[geneb]

kbob, this is absolutely brilliant! THIS is the kind of feedback I wanted to see! I'll only comment on some of these, but I've printed the message out in order to use it as a reference this evening.

P3, para 4: That was an oversight on my part. It should be shown covering the wiring & bowden tube.

P3, para 7: Cheap yardsticks are common as dirt in places like Home Depot, Lowes, Menard's, etc. New kits _may_ include a pre-cut stick cut out of the unused area on one of the melamine sheets.

P4: XT60 or Deans were spec'd not because of their power transmission ability, but their ability to withstand high temperatures. The links given for the connectors were for five packs, so I didn't feel it necessary to include a part count, but I'll do that now.

P7, para 2: I'll include a pointer to the SeeMeCNC github repo. That's where the new manual will be published.

The melamine bed for the Onyx has no part number that I'm aware of AND it's not in the stack of laser cut Melamine parts, but you're correct - it should have been included in the table.

I cannot believe I managed to skip installing the bowden tube. Another Picard Facepalm for me.

Writing this thing without an editor can be hard at times. Thank you very much for taking the time to go through it! I'll post a note here when I've made some changes.

g.