Is your ISP screwing you?

[bubbasnow]

Welp, i went ahead and changed internet service providers a few months back. Went with a new to the area company "Vivint", they were supposed to be the fastest offered and they probably still are. But speed is not everything, i noticed soon after changing over that i would have horrible connections to servers while playing Xbox live games. I would get booted out of games but then would be able to immediately join.

Weird i thought to myself, during these disconnects i would run to my computer and see if i had internet, which i did most of the time. I would perform a speed test yadda yadda and get decent results (nothing near promised). So it seems like I am either having high packet loss or random disconnects from service, but by the time i would be connected to customer support the problem would seem to fix itself. The over the phone technician would flip some switches and press some keys and tell me that everything looks good on their end.

Needing proof that something was wrong, I found a way to prove that i am getting constant disconnects and horrible speeds, i would start logging my speed test results. Because i would need to gather as much data as possible, manually logging speed test results would be a horrible idea, i needed a scheduler that could do it for me all day and all night. but my computer is not always on, so writing a program on the machine wouldn't be the best solution either.

First I used a raspberry pi, but because of the 10/100 Ethernet port, i could easily tell by comparison with my PC that speeds were not equal while running the test one after another.

Upgraded to a ODROID C1+ and things seemed spot on, i forked a previously made speedtest CLI code i found on github, modified it as to enable logging, the cron'd some tasks including emailing me the results of a days speeds in a .csv file.

I then wrote a c# program to plot the info and save as a png so i could visually show these people the issues i am having. this PDF of last months results was sent to vivint for review.... wish me luck for some discounted Internets

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByTdMD ... sp=sharing

[Jimustanguitar]

That's a lot of data, wow!

Forgive my skimming, perhaps you've already done this... I'd suggest generating a summary sheet with big colorful graphs (like you'd show your boss' boss) that quantify what percentage of the time you were below the contracted data-rate and what percentage of the time you were receiving what you paid for, and what the overall average rate was.

Have you gone through their documentation to see if they have a benchmark for the highs and lows that you should expect? Have others done this sort of a survey and gone to battle with the data companies?

I also went through one of those "ok, we'll send out a technician" issues with my data-rate, and after the 5th or 6th time we just switched carriers. Hopefully you get somewhere with it for all of the trouble you've gone through to document it.

[drunkenmugsy]

I wish you luck but if you want performance you need to get a business class line and pay the $$ for it. Residential service is oversold, by design, always, no exceptions.

If you think a residential ISP is going to make money by selling 50MB slices of their 1000MB pipe to only 20 people you are delusional. More than likely there are 500 people on it. All of them promised best effort 50MB.

Yes I work for a regional ISP. A commercial one. We dont deal with residential now but we used to over a decade ago. We started out providing DSL and dialup. We easily had hundreds(400+) of 512KB and 768KB dsl customers on a single 45MB pipe. We would put thousands of dialup customers on the same 45MB pipe. Yes that was a while ago but the example remains the same. Only the speed of the pipes has changed. Now we deal in 10GB to our carriers and customers want their own 1GB+ pipes just for themselves. They can get it - for a price. We have customers in the $10k to $700K+ per month range.

Find an ISP who gives you a speed/latency reliably that you can live with for the $$ and stay with them.

[bubbasnow]

from their main page:

There's nothing more frustrating than bad Internet. You've had enough waiting and teeth grinding to last you a lifetime, so let's get rid of that 7:00 p.m. slowdown. Finally.

from their faq:

What speeds should I expect?
Speeds may vary due to many factors outside of Vivint’s control, including your device performance, wireless signal strength, traffic on the Internet, etc. Vivint will make every effort to ensure the highest possible quality of service is always delivered, but Vivint does not guarantee the maximum service performance levels or guarantee service availability at all times. Average speeds for the 50 Mbps package should be consistently over 40 Mbps and average speeds for the 25 Mbps package should be above 15 Mbps.

I'm using the 50Mbps service, so according to these two things from their website I would expect at least 40Mbps during prime hours... not 1-9am like i see on my plots.

I'm hoping for a reduced monthly rate else i will claim they voided their contract by not providing adequate service they sold me.

I mainly posted this in case someone else wanted to test their own connection not to complain about my own problems ;P

[626Pilot]

Cable providers usually oversell their capacity, and then they blame "factors outside their control" when in fact they just aren't provisioning enough bandwidth to do what they agreed to in the first place. Kinda like getting to the airport and being informed that you've been bumped off a flight.

They will probably laugh at your data, and delete the email, because they already know everything in those graphs. ISPs collect metrics like this as a matter of course. I used to write software that a national ISP used to do this very thing - trust me, they know.

If you get lucky and they do something about it, congratulations.

If not, send the graphs to a few newspapers and local blogs. Carbon-copy your ISP. See if they still try to get away with it then.

[KAS]

I'm not sure how many people are familiar with the SamKnows project to gather "real" information from ISP's.
Basically a few years back, people would sign up for their area and ISP. If selected they would send a pre-configuerd router that tests your ISP and compares against advertised service.
With that information from; the FCC and NTIA(National Telecommunications and Information Administration), they created the http://www.broadbandmap.gov/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I don't see much for Vivint except for the wireless. Is it possible they are reselling wired service through another carrier?


http://www.broadbandmap.gov/about-provi ... e-of-utah/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.broadbandmap.gov/internet-se ... 330000004/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[geneb]

drunkenmugsy, are you a BOFH?

I did a stint as a sysadmin for an ISP in 1996. I quit soon after I found myself screaming obscenities at some poor sales guy over a US Robotics Total Control NetServer failure. I could've opened a vein an used it as the world's most gruesome waterjet cutter. (The NetServer is how we were able to provide 56k dialup service - it two two PRIs to feed it - 46 circuits total (48?) Our "normal" modem bank consisted of a pile of rack-mounted USR Sportster[*] modems connected to a pair of Livingston Portmaster 30's. Those were the days. )

g.

* You can rack mount a Sportster by taking it out of the case and sticking it into a special box designed to hold each modem by it's DB25 conector. Crude, but effective.

[626Pilot]

USR still sells their 56K modems, still using the same clean-looking cases they did in the '90s. They were the big deal around town, back in the days when people cared about dialup bulletin board systems, and ISPs and pseudo-ISPs like Netcom and AOL. The ISP I worked for had a bank of them for their registration server. Regular dialup was through Nortel boxes, each of which terminated a DS3. Those came in over several OC48 lines. It was fun to work in that place.

[Eric]

Once upon a time Sony acquired three DS3's, which was all the spare bandwidth to be found at the time (early 1999) in the San Diego area. Once Everquest launched (one of the big success stories early on in the MMORPG industry), we quickly found out those DS3's had been oversold and we we were only getting about 2/3's of the bandwidth we'd bought. To be fair, the provider probably weren't expecting us to actually use the pipes at capacity 24/7, but that is what we'd bought, and after a couple months we actually got it. More fiber arrived in the area late in the year, so the situation got better after that.

My major involvement in EQ was the login servers...making them survive DDOS levels of traffic (20K login requests/sec or more, quite normal after any game downtime) was a challenge.

[bubbasnow]

I'm not sure how many people are familiar with the SamKnows project to gather "real" information from ISP's.
Basically a few years back, people would sign up for their area and ISP. If selected they would send a pre-configuerd router that tests your ISP and compares against advertised service.
With that information from; the FCC and NTIA(National Telecommunications and Information Administration), they created the http://www.broadbandmap.gov/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I don't see much for Vivint except for the wireless. Is it possible they are reselling wired service through another carrier?


http://www.broadbandmap.gov/about-provi ... e-of-utah/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.broadbandmap.gov/internet-se ... 330000004/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

sorry if i wasent clear before, i have a radio on my roof. My vivint is wireless

[626Pilot]

My major involvement in EQ was the login servers...making them survive DDOS levels of traffic (20K login requests/sec or more, quite normal after any game downtime) was a challenge.

I love that kind of work. I used to work for an IT firm that hired me for my advice, didn't listen to it, set things on fire, and then I'd have to clean up the mess. One time they brought in a site that got tens of thousands of pageviews a day because a project manager decided, on a lark, to migrate it on a Sunday night. Nobody told me, even though I always did those. On Monday morning, I walked in to see that everything was hosed, the customers were furious and cursing our name, etc. I hit up my trusty DB analyst, and between ourselves we had everything ship-shape in about ten minutes.

It turns out that CEOs like to hire people who remind them of themselves. However, this project manager was young, inexperienced, and impulsive. He had no IT experience at all - he was hired because he had started and sold a successful business elsewhere, one that had absolutely nothing to do with computers of any kind. Because he knew how to dress, talk, and act in front of the CEO, he got the job. That kind of stuff is why I work for myself now. If anything goes wrong, I never have to wonder whose fault it is, or whose responsibility it is to fix it. I will never work in a cubicle farm again unless there's no other choice.

[geneb]

I think one of the more enjoyable things working for a small ISP was the Quake clan. Being at the top of a fat pipe gave real meaning to "low ping bastards".

Our Sr. Tech's daughter loved to play Quake with us, especially deathmatches with other clans. There's nothing quite like watching an 11 year old girl in a frilly pink dress mutter things like, "Stop running so I can kill you!" We nicknamed her Elizideath. One hell of an awesome Quake player. Our favorite quip was, "So, how's it feel to have your ass handed to you by an 11 year old girl?" They thought we were just talking sh*t until one of the other techs posted a pic of her running some guy down with a nail gun. Oh the nerd rage! *laughs*

g.

[barry99705]

[img]http://speedof.me/result/151007080202-112128.png[/img]

Seems to be doing alright by me. We pay for 50/5.

[626Pilot]

I think one of the more enjoyable things working for a small ISP was the Quake clan. Being at the top of a fat pipe gave real meaning to "low ping bastards".

The first time I ever played a multiplayer shooter was with my boss, Doom 1 on an IPX network. The first thing that happened was that I put a shotgun shell between his shoulderblades.

[SEBRET]

well if we're posting speed tests then. . .

We pay for 105/20 so no complaints here.

[barry99705]

well if we're posting speed tests then. . .

speed.jpg

We pay for 105/20 so no complaints here.

Nice! We're supposed to get 100mbps in my area around November-ish. Our account will automagically jump to that speed, which is why I get higher than 50 now.

[EL Cuajinais]

Our favorite quip was, "So, how's it feel to have your ass handed to you by an 11 year old girl?" :Dg.

To be able to say that to an adult male, and have it be literal. Love it. Can't think of many other situations where this could apply.

Reminds my of the best internet comment I've seen in my life:
So there was an article about a skydiving couple that supposedly had sex in midair. The gist of the article was that the FAA investigated the incident and found no cause for any legal proceedings. I don't recall the actual headline for the article, but this commenter wrote:

The headline of the article should have been:

The FAA doesn't give a flying f#ck!

[Eric]

Our favorite quip was, "So, how's it feel to have your ass handed to you by an 11 year old girl?" :Dg.

To be able to say that to an adult male, and have it be literal. Love it. Can't think of many other situations where this could apply.

Reminds my of the best internet comment I've seen in my life:
So there was an article about a skydiving couple that supposedly had sex in midair. The gist of the article was that the FAA investigated the incident and found no cause for any legal proceedings. I don't recall the actual headline for the article, but this commenter wrote:

The headline of the article should have been:

The FAA doesn't give a flying f#ck!

Basically true, so long as no FAA regulations are broken. The FAA regulates when and where jumps can be made and that the parachutes be packed by certified riggers. But once you jump out of the plane, it's technically a self-regulated sport and you've assumed personal responsibility for the trip to the ground. The US Parachute Organization has a bunch of additional safety rules/certifications that equipment and training operators tend to enforce for liability reasons, but they aren't actually law. Things like consenual sex in public would be up to the local authorities to charge...no reason to involve the FAA. They'd probably have a hard time proving it was "in public" in court, as being a mile or more away from any ground observer gives one a reasonable expectation of privacy from the naked eye.

[drunkenmugsy]

drunkenmugsy, are you a BOFH?

I dont know about BOFH but I definitely fit the bastard part. Been doing various IT things for many years.

[Jrjones]

You've already said that your computer isn't on all the time, but if you can leave it on, theres a site that does user configurable auto speedtests.

Try http://testmy.net/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I like that it keeps my history and I can download the results as a csv format.

[bubbasnow]

well, running these tests over the month of September.. i have consumed quite a bit of download data.

[barry99705]

Between my wife moving large work files back and forth to her office, and the apple tv, we use quite a bit of data. All the data use only averages three and a half megabits per second though.
[img]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-wV5t ... titled.png[/img]

[bubbasnow]

looks like they are getting their acts together

I hope they keep it up