Trick Laser MAX METAL Build

[Renha]

Thanks for everyone's help for identifying that part.

i have OpenSCAD version of that part if you need, have redone for it to be adjustable

[bvandiepenbos]

You should be able to mount end stop switches with this...
http://openbuildspartstore.com/micro-li ... ing-plate/
I did not use the above, but just drilled and tapped 2 M3 holes in frame side extrusion near corners.
With 6-32 nut and washer as a spacer to raise switch off extrusion.
You don't have to use the printed corner bracket, although it is a nice design.

[mhackney]

Brian, have you investigated linear rails for the Max or Max Metal? My mini kossel with rails is so quite you can't even tell it's running. My other machines with carriages make a swish swish noise. I am thinking about going rails on my max metal build. But the 24mm wide rails which seem like a good fit for 1" towers are also heavy and thick. The mini rails used on the kossel are more than stiff and strong enough but they might look silly and I wonder about the width of the delta arm mounts maybe causing some problems on the narrow blocks.

[bvandiepenbos]

Brian, have you investigated linear rails for the Max or Max Metal? My mini kossel with rails is so quite you can't even tell it's running. My other machines with carriages make a swish swish noise. I am thinking about going rails on my max metal build. But the 24mm wide rails which seem like a good fit for 1" towers are also heavy and thick. The mini rails used on the kossel are more than stiff and strong enough but they might look silly and I wonder about the width of the delta arm mounts maybe causing some problems on the narrow blocks.

Michael, yes I have looked into linear rails for the MAX but I wonder if the extra cost is worth any small gain (if any) over V wheels? I am surprised you say the rails on your kossel are quite, I find the recirculating balls in the linear rails are noisy. Are the rails the typical rectangle style?
I think the wide rails would be the way to go. The narrow just don't have enough width for a sturdy carriage. I am afraid after a bit of use and slightest amount of wear the carriage would be able to twist and wobble... and there is no adjustment to get just the right action/fit. I know this from years of experience, my laser cutters X lens carriage runs on a single narrow rail, with the slightest amount of wear the lens gets sloppy. I end up replacing rail every 6-9 months.
I think I would use TWO narrow rails per tower, one on each side of extrusion. With a carriage plate connecting them. Although that may be kind of heavy and would cost twice as much.

What I REALLY have been wanting to try on a delta printer are these LM76 Brand "Speed Demon" rails. I think they would be awesome... precise, smooth, light, adjustable and not to costly really.
http://www.automation4less.com/lm76sg.htm
Just have not had enough time.

By the way, I buy my linear rails for our lasers from Automation 4 Less. Decent prices, fast service, great people to work with.
http://www.automation4less.com/linearh.htm

[mhackney]

I'm convinced after running kossels with rails and with wheels that rails are more precise and quieter and never need adjusting. Mine are dead quiet you literally can't hear anything. It is astounding. Yes, these are the rectangular Mitsumi 12mm rails.

I was concerned about the narrow rail width. I need a wide rail with low profile and not to heavy. I've used rails on a CNC router for coming on 10 years now and there is no noticeable/measurable wear. And it has a lot more fire on it than the printer will.

I wanted to avoid 2 rails to eliminate that whole adjustment thing. It was hard enough to do on the router I wouldn't want to do it X3 on the Max!

I've used A4Less but didn't think to check there. The speed demons look very interesting. I think I'm "in"! I'll let you know what I come up with. Need to do some research and/or give them a call.

[mhackney]

Yeah, I think I'm going to go for the demon speed rails. Looks like the SGB 10 size should be a good compromise. Not too high (23mm) and at w8 mm wide for the carriages that should provide good support. In fact, it might be interesting to mill the carriage cross piece offset to recover some of the height so as to place the pivot point in the same plane as the top surface of the block.

Now I just need to figure out how long of rails I need. The cost is actually great and covers a range of lengths but it would be good to have them cut to my specifications so it's one less thing to do!

[bot]

I'm using some misumi PLRH25-xxx rails and they are fantastic. Very light-duty, but perfectly suited for a delta. They can be run greased or not. There were some rough spots in a couple of the rails (very light detents where the mounting holes were drilled) but it does not affect print quality. They are about $30 each for the length needed.

[mhackney]

Those look good too. I did end up ordering the SGB10s in full length rail so I can cut to fit my build. Should be an interesting experiment at least.

[626Pilot]

You want your printer to run quiet?

http://www.tridprinting.com/Electronics/

Scroll down to Vibration Dampers. The first item is Astrosyn's MY17RMDAMP. Your extruders will be the loudest thing on your printer, by far. Used to be you had to order these from England, but TriDPrinting is right here in North America. These took my old Rostock MAX from ear-killingly loud to whisper quiet, and my MAX METAL from annoyingly loud to hardly anything.

[mhackney]

I have those vibration dampers on all my printers. They help but the kossel is magically quiet. It's not the steppers or extruders that make the noise I'm referring to. It must be coming from the rollers as that's the only difference between my mini with linear guides and kossel and kossel 250 with delrin rollers. The 250 and Rostock sound similar.

When I say my mini kossel is quiet I mean that you literally can not hear a sound from 5' away. It is amazing. It sits right behind my desk (<5) and when it prints I can't hear it.

[bvandiepenbos]

What electronics does the mini have?
That makes a big difference also.

I have vibration those dampers on all my printers. They help but the kossel is magically quiet. It's not the steppers or extruders that make the noise I'm referring to. It must be coming from the rollers as that's the only difference between my mini with linear guides and kossel and kossel 250 with delrin rollers. The 250 and Rostock sound similar.

When I say my mini kossel is quiet I mean that you literally can not hear a sound from 5' away. It is amazing. It sits right behind my desk (<5) and when it prints I can't hear it.

[mhackney]

It's not the electronics, its had both smoothie and Duet on it and it is dead quiet with both.

Meawhile, I got home from my business trip in Rochester, NY tonight and a long skinny package was waiting for me! The SGB 10 speed demon rails for the MAX METAL came in! Firstly, these were shipped out of MA very near me, odd!

Secondly, I did not realize this but the way they are made is very cool. The aluminum extrusion is U shaped and black anodized. The rails are steel rods - look to be about 1/4" in diameter - that run inside the arms of the U. If you look closely at the photo here you can see what I mean. I thought the business end was going to be delrin wheels against aluminum but it's steel rollers with bearings against steel rails. The carriages have integrated felt wipers too. Very cool.

Cheers,
Michael

[Eaglezsoar]

It's not the electronics, its had both smoothie and Duet on it and it is dead quiet with both.

Meawhile, I got home from my business trip in Rochester, NY tonight and a long skinny package was waiting for me! The SGB 10 speed demon rails for the MAX METAL came in! Firstly, these were shipped out of MA very near me, odd!

Secondly, I did not realize this but the way they are made is very cool. The aluminum extrusion is U shaped and black anodized. The rails are steel rods - look to be about 1/4" in diameter - that run inside the arms of the U. If you look closely at the photo here you can see what I mean. I thought the business end was going to be delrin wheels against aluminum but it's steel rollers with bearings against steel rails. The carriages have integrated felt wipers too. Very cool.

Cheers,
Michael

Could you say who you purchased these from?

[bvandiepenbos]

http://www.automation4less.com/lm76sg.htm

@Michael, you got the SG style like this, right?
http://www.lm76.com/speed_guide.htm
You linked OSG style.

[mhackney]

@Eagle Yup, from automation4less.

@Brian Yes, I got the SG style. The link I posted actually goes to a page with both styles for me. Isn't that what you see too?

I haven't assembled my Metal Max frame yet but I'm guessing I'm going to have to do some work to position the belts in the right place since these add a little "thickness" to the towers. No big deal, I just haven't seen what's involved yet.

Also, with the steel rods as part of the system a simple cut off saw to shorten them is out of the question. I don't know IF I'll have to cut these, I held one up to my V1 and it was nearly perfect length. I need to get the frame assembled so I can sort this all out. The good news is my rails, three .9° steppers, belts, pulleys, power supply and a box of six BondTech QR extruders and another box of four geared steppers all showed up yesterday! Lots of toys to play with if I only had the time!

[Eaglezsoar]

@Eagle Yup, from automation4less.

@Brian Yes, I got the SG style. The link I posted actually goes to a page with both styles for me. Isn't that what you see too?

I haven't assembled my Metal Max frame yet but I'm guessing I'm going to have to do some work to position the belts in the right place since these add a little "thickness" to the towers. No big deal, I just haven't seen what's involved yet.

Also, with the steel rods as part of the system a simple cut off saw to shorten them is out of the question. I don't know IF I'll have to cut these, I held one up to my V1 and it was nearly perfect length. I need to get the frame assembled so I can sort this all out. The good news is my rails, three .9° steppers, belts, pulleys, power supply and a box of six BondTech QR extruders and another box of four geared steppers all showed up yesterday! Lots of toys to play with if I only had the time!

Do you purchase your Bondtech extruders from the American Distributor or the off shore manufacturer? I bought one from the American distributor and it looks like it is going to take 4 days to reach me.

[mhackney]

I bought mine from BondTech direct. The US distributor did not have them when I ordered mine. Also, I bought mine w/o the stepper since I have plenty of those. I think the distributor only carries the entire unit. And, when you purchase 8 extruders, it's best to work directly with the company!

[nitewatchman]

I bought mine directly from Sweden. Ordered on Saturday night, Shipped on Monday morning from Sweden, Delivered 8:00am on Wednesday. Cost $20 but it works.

[mhackney]

@nitewatchman, if you buy 6 at a time the $20 shipping doesn't seem so bad!

[mhackney]

@nitewatchman - also, I gave my Rostock mount to Martin (BondTech) and he added a few details. I don't know if it's posted on his website yet. I'll ask if I can post a copy here. Do you have a V1 or V2? I think the V1 mount holes on the top plate are 40mm and the V2 are 50 so we'll have to make a different mount for V2.

[Eaglezsoar]

I bought mine directly from Sweden. Ordered on Saturday night, Shipped on Monday morning from Sweden, Delivered 8:00am on Wednesday. Cost $20 but it works.

Wow that is fast from Sweden. Michael is right though, if you can afford to buy 3-4 then the shipping isn't so bad. My first one was ordered from Texas on Wednesday and I am still waiting for it.

[mhackney]

Both of my orders were only 3 days from day of ship too.

[nitewatchman]

@nitewatchman - also, I gave my Rostock mount to Martin (BondTech) and he added a few details. I don't know if it's posted on his website yet. I'll ask if I can post a copy here. Do you have a V1 or V2? I think the V1 mount holes on the top plate are 40mm and the V2 are 50 so we'll have to make a different mount for V2.

Mine is a V2, I'll check the hole centers. I am not opposed to shooting another hole in the melamine either. I don't know that Martin has posted the mount yet but looks like he has added his trademark.

[Eaglezsoar]

Looks like Sweden it is for the Bondtech Qr extruders. I like the fact that you can buy them without the geared motors.
I have about 5 of the geared motors in my part box and I am 90% sure that they are the 5:1 motors.

[nitewatchman]

@nitewatchman - also, I gave my Rostock mount to Martin (BondTech) and he added a few details. I don't know if it's posted on his website yet. I'll ask if I can post a copy here. Do you have a V1 or V2? I think the V1 mount holes on the top plate are 40mm and the V2 are 50 so we'll have to make a different mount for V2.

Mine is a V2, I'll check the hole centers. I am not opposed to shooting another hole in the melamine either. I don't know that Martin has posted the mount yet but looks like he has added his trademark.

Measured center to center for the mounting holes on my V2 and the distance is 50mm.