Welcome to the SeeMeCNC Community

Hi all,

Well, we finally pulled the trigger and have a Rostock MAX v2 kit on the way. I'll be assisted on the build by my 11 year old (pretty good with Raspberry PI/Arduino and coding) and my 9 year old (pretty good with a soldering iron and hand tools.) I'd like to have the kids help with documenting the build, so they'll be checking this thread from time to time.

Anyway - we ran into our first snag. My plan was to build the v2 stock with an PI 3 Octoprint printer server. We have a PI 2 to start on, so a couple of questions:

1 - We cannot get Octoprint to recognize the octopi-network.txt file during bootup. It runs fine on ethernet (although not with the proper assigned IP address.) We cannot get it to run the WPA portion to join our wireless network. I've reflashed the SD card about a half dozen times and followed the instructions each time with no luck. Everything else looks great, and on wired connection it looks like it will work as a printer server just fine. Has anyone else experienced this? (BTW - I tried flashing the wheezy stable build and the jessie nightly build, but saw the same problem.)

2 - In searching for a solution, I noticed that the Octoprint subforum's posts are a bit old/dated. Is this because there is another preferred solution? Are people using other boards that can also be a printer server (such as Duet)?

3 - Has anyone successfully put a Raspberry PI 3 on their v2?

4 - I understand that the RAMBo is a bit long in the tooth. I've been reading and following Sublime Layers for a bit now, and I've been trying to decide if the PI 3 setup is actually money well spent, or if I should build the v2 and use the PI 2 wired for now, then just plan on converting the electronics over to Duet/Paneldue in a few months? Any suggestions/guidance?

Thanks very much. UPS says delivery on the main unit is this week.

I have a new Pi3, and have decided to wait until a stable octopi build is available... I don't want to deal with the nightly builds that do support the new hardware. I do run OctoPi on a Pi 2b' and that runs fine. By the time you get your machine built, hopefully OctoPi will be stable on the 3.

It's good that you're getting the kids involved in the build process.

I'm not sure how to help with 1. other than to point you at this post, which may help: http://forum.seemecnc.com/viewtopic.php ... ifi#p78035

2. Octoprint was one solution to printing away from a larger computer, which many people didn't see a need for (It also gave you web-cam support, but a Nest Cam is easier these days by far). Others, like printing from an SD card, using duet, or running a BBB based solution with the slicer installed on the controller itself also exist, which means it wasn't something everyone was going for. It also, as you noticed, has some 'fun' teething troubles.

3. Not as far as I know, but then, many people run in stealth mode, and it may work OK, so no one ever asked for help about it.

4. The Rambo is a capable, but basic controller (at least given the proliferation of solutions like the Duet, Smoothieboard, and Replicape, which manage to pack surprisingly excellent hardware into a nice price point, when it came along it was a nice improvement in quality of life over the RAMPS board). It has some issues with the extra overhead of delta kinematics, but does OK. I've not replaced mine yet, but I have been looking into it. My evaluation of those I've looked at is below, but be aware, I haven't used any yet, nor am I a real guru (626 for Smoothie, and Mike for the Duet are the people to talk to.)
Smoothie family:
-Excellent software, with a branch designed for delta calibration.
-Hardware is more than capable, but somewhat memory constrained in the current version.
-Is designed to support other tools such as laser cutters and mills, and has some level of documentation for that.
-Thermocouple, but not PT100 support, gives it potential high temperature capacity, but does not goes as high as it could, and uses a slightly less convenient sensor (I don't like using anything but PT100s, since I can just pop them in and out with a setscrew, and not worry at all). The main developers are uninterested in PT100 support. (They have been asked)
- The V2 is due out at some point, and has multiple versions, all of which are a boost on the processor, but the code is also getting significantly refactored.
-Has some glitches due to bone-headed mistakes on the part of some slicer developers. (single micron moves need not apply).
- A variety of boards support it
-SD card acts a bit weird, and access is somewhat odd. Flakey even at times, due to the SD card being considered to be mounted by two different file-systems when connected (Or something. I'm a machinist, not a programmer (Or at least, not that kind of programmer. I write in G, not C))
-has had a few QC slip-ups in the past, but none noted recently.

Duet:
-Very excellent calibration and delta support.
-Very usable interface in general, and web in specific.
-Segmentless delta kinematics make more accurate, better looking parts.
-Supports a touchscreen interface with very little overhead. (and you can pick one you like)
-Thermocouple, but no PT100 support. Developers have not to my knowledge discounted PT100 support.

Replicape:
-Very powerful hardware.
-Only basic delta support, but firmware is in active development.
-No need for 24-12V stepdown converters for fans/lights or steppers, as one is built in for the lights/fans, and the stepper drivers handle 24V well.
-Cheap price (Lower than the Rambo)
-PT100 support in on the table, and Thermocouples are workable.
-One-wire low temp sensors (sub 100 C really) can be connected to monitor temperatures, for additional data and control.
-Can run slicer and other things on board
-Connectable to displays via standard cables (HDMI), and can be attached to a very nice touch screen (The Manga screen was developed by the same fellow)
-1/256 programmable microstepping, in addition to other modes are available.
-stepper drivers are as quiet as you are likely to find.
-Original boards have the Reach for expansion, the Rev B is potentially getting one as well.

I am currently torn as to which controller. Both the Duet and Smoothie work very well. The Replicape has immense potential, and is being worked on fairly actively. But the Rambo works OK, so long as you don't get unlucky on the calibration front (Which is what minions... Err, kids, are for). Give it a try with the Rambo for a while, and then decide what's important to you. And the longer you wait, the better your options get.

Dionysus480 wrote:1 - We cannot get Octoprint to recognize the octopi-network.txt file during bootup.

I could never get it to work via octopi-network.txt either. Ultimately I just logged into the RPi with a keyboard and monitor and messed around with the /etc/network/interfaces file until I got it to work.

There's a few tutorials:

https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentati ... /wireless/
http://weworkweplay.com/play/automatica ... i-network/

Once I got it working it is great and I use it for controlling my printer with minimal issues.

The details, alas, depend on your network configuration. Just keep messing and fiddling with it until you get it to work. Use this for inspiration:
[img]http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/tech_suppor ... _sheet.png[/img]
From: https://xkcd.com/627/

I have a pi3 running octoprint with a printrboard, seems to be working great. I installed the latest raspbian, updated it, installed octoprint via ssh using their guide(not the image), installed a vnc server, logged in with VNC to set up the wifi in the gui, set up a static IP on my router(Assigns static ip to the mac address) and its been good to go. Make sure you expand the file system via raspi-config.

When I attempted to use Octoprint with the Rambo a year ago or so, it was very inconsistent, not octoprint, but the USB connection to the Rambo, whether its the controller or something else. I could never get it, or Repetier server to work reliably. Works fine with the printrboard and my RADDS(arduino due)

I've been having freeze issues with a pi2/Octoprint. It took awhile to narrow the problem down to a specific LED light on the same house circuit and at a certain time of time night of which the source is unknown.

I'm dropping back to SDcard only prints. If this is your first printer, I would stick with the stock machine until you get your feet wet. It's not fun chasing ghosts if you are still in the learning process.

try looping the usb cable through a ferrite ring and see if that fixes the issue. (alternately, don't buy cheap LED bulbs. )

g.

Thanks for the replies guys, I'll set the kids loose on /etc/network/interfaces and see if they can get it to work. Its spring break and thats a better project that playing the latest Battlefront level.

An awesome project for you and the kids. We put ours together last year and it has been awesome Dad time with the kids. It won't end since you will keep building and adding/upgrading. At the current time, we are adding the Duet and PanelDuo...... Thus, far I'm impressed with setting it up and flexibility....... however, have yet to print with it...... just now calibrating....

Welcome, you will have a ton of fun!!!!

geneb wrote:try looping the usb cable through a ferrite ring and see if that fixes the issue. (alternately, don't buy cheap LED bulbs. )

g.

Good idea.. will give it a try. The USB cable I have does have a ferrite ring in it, but in may cases, they are not really tuned for the application and more there for looks. It was a lesson learned from an EMI expert when witnessing some CE testing on a new product. Problem is I don't have the means to optimize for the best ferrite ring, so more can be better according to what he said.

LED was a UtilTech brand. It may be noisy, but they have withstood exterior use whereas the higher dollar units have not.

Thanks for the guidance guys. We received our kit yesterday and did our part check-in. Separating the laser sheets and painting edges this weekend.

Anyway - in Octoprint, editing the etc/network/interfaces directly did the trick. I had to comment out the reference to the octopi-network.txt file altogether. But we have a printer server, webcam, and whatnot ready for the day we need it. I am wondering about the connection reliability. After others pointed it out, I've noticed ours seems to "go to sleep" which I'm assuming would ruin the print. Unsure if it would do that if a print was actually running and had activity, but SD cards seem like a good place to start.

Thanks again - kids are loving it and I'm getting quality time with them.

Well - the build is going well and we're all having a blast. I did come up with a few questions.

1 - A few of the capture nuts used to create an end-side structural joint seem to spin in their hole. If I can slip a wrench over it, its not a big deal. However, one is occurring on a vertical support that does not have any reasonable way for me to reach with a wrench. Anyone have a good way to secure the nuts so I can tighten against the resistance of the nylon?

I feel like if I pull the top base plate I'll never get it back on again.

2 - The only mods I have in store for the initial build are the astrosyn dampers on the 3 tower motors, and the Tricklaser LED ring so I can see what its doing. Where is the typical place people get the 12 v for the light ring? Is it appropriate to get it from the PEEK or Layer fan circuits? Do I pull a separate circuit up a tower?

3 - Which towers are the best candidates to have an extra pair of wires included? I've even considered that I may want to add some form of FSR system eventually, and it seems like I could pull some extra wires now and leave them bundled out of the way until that day comes.

Thanks guys.

Dionysus480 wrote:Well - the build is going well and we're all having a blast. I did come up with a few questions.

1 - A few of the capture nuts used to create an end-side structural joint seem to spin in their hole. If I can slip a wrench over it, its not a big deal. However, one is occurring on a vertical support that does not have any reasonable way for me to reach with a wrench. Anyone have a good way to secure the nuts so I can tighten against the resistance of the nylon?

I feel like if I pull the top base plate I'll never get it back on again.

2 - The only mods I have in store for the initial build are the astrosyn dampers on the 3 tower motors, and the Tricklaser LED ring so I can see what its doing. Where is the typical place people get the 12 v for the light ring? Is it appropriate to get it from the PEEK or Layer fan circuits? Do I pull a separate circuit up a tower?

3 - Which towers are the best candidates to have an extra pair of wires included? I've even considered that I may want to add some form of FSR system eventually, and it seems like I could pull some extra wires now and leave them bundled out of the way until that day comes.

Thanks guys.

1) I found that getting a small pair of needle-nose pliers close enough to the edges of the nylon lock-nuts, that I was able to put enough pressure on the nut to keep it from spinning while I tightened down the screw.

2) The astrosyns and a light ring will be a wonderful addition to the printer. As for where to tie in the light ring, I can not necessarily speak for the Tricklaser ring, but with a different set of LEDs that I got from another member of the forums, I tied the LEDs inline with the peek fan along with a voltage regulator and a resistor (my LEDs were designed to run off of something like 5v)

3) In the past, I have managed to run extra wires down the Y axis (Facing the front of the printer, the front right tower). You will almost always want to avoid running them down the X axis, as this is where your endstop wires are run, and any interference across these lines can cause your printer to do wonky things.

Glad you are having fun taking on this project with the kids! If either of them are interested in string instruments, or more specifically cellos, once you get your teeth whet with the 3d printer and feel like taking on a moderately difficult build (yet satisfying when finished), let me know and I will send over my files to print my electric 3D cello that I designed.

Thanks very much. I got a pair of hemostats back into it and got it tight enough. Just sort of jammed them into the side to take up room and stop the spinning.

I got to work on it for a couple of hours today. I did pass an extra pair of conductors up each extrusion for use later. I'll keep in mind that the z-axis ones might be problematic and maybe I'll just leave them for the foreseeable future. It dawned on me that an FSR wouldn't need anything up top. I have extra conductors for lights or other cool stuff.

I'll probably just tie the lights into the PEEK fan. Seems like a good candidate. I can't really imagine a time when I'll want the light off when its running. Its a good reminder for the kids that if the lights are on the hotend is ... well... hot. Especially until I get an enclosure printed/built.

Some of the 26g wires seemed a little short. If I leave the 30" as indicated in the manual, it doesn't reach the RAMBo. I decided I'd splice what I needed near the hotend rather than risk running short of the RAMBo. Worst case was having to splice into both ends.

Anyway, coming along.

Current question. Any guidance on belt tension? How do I know if its tight enough?

OK - First real bump in the road.

Want to say first that SeeMeCNC has been great about shipping out a part that broke during assembly. They're fantastic.

The problem: My LCD lights up blue, but doesn't show any block. I haven't uploaded the firmware or anything yet. I'm back looking at the RAMBo. Anyone have good troubleshooting tips? Should I go ahead and upload firmware?

Specifically -

Finished mechanical portion of the build.
Smoke Test passed with no smoke.
LCD blue. If I had to guess, the contrast is wrong. (Red PCB on the LCD.)
No blocks.

Thanks for any guidance.

Upload the firmware and THEN worry about the display if it's not showing up.

g.

I was just re-checking my wiring and thought I'd upload pics in case anyone catches anything I didn't.

After firmware the LCD is "on" but there are no letters visible. Just a uniform blue.

Hmmm. I also rechecked my configuration.h file and its correct.

Ideas on where to go are slowing down... Guess I'll fiddle.

Thanks

OK - just finished my PEEK fan print. Next question came up.

Does anyone have a favorite layer fan shroud that works with the Tricklaser LED Ring. I keep searching it but don't really see anything I like.

Still looking for a layer fan design that works with the tricklaser LED ring. I haven't printed the stock fan, is it possible to put a standoff under it to use that design?

I'm not pleased with the "eyeball and paper" calibration, although the prints don't look awful. I'm having first layer issues, so I'm printing a dial mount to mess with.

So, I've really messed up my first fablam covering. ABS is sticking so well I can't get it off easily. I placed it directly on the borosilicate glass. SeeMeCNC says to lower the bed heat to 60C. I was printing at the manual suggested 80C, so I can try that. It would also help with bed heating, since it wouldn't have to go so high. My question is whether I should but it on something flexible like plexiglass. It wouldn't conduct heat as well, but I could "pop" stubborn parts off by flexing it. Are there suggestions on the "best" way to use FabLam?

Also, the astrosyn dampers are pretty darn cool. The large cooling fan is loud. Does anyone have a source on a good quiet replacement?

Oh - and I'm planning for a Xenocrates modified Raymond enclosure. I think I can get the sheet goods locally. What is the most cost effective way to handle the joints? I've seen the plastic piano hinges, but would CA or silicone glue work?

Thanks.

Dionysus480 wrote:Still looking for a layer fan design that works with the tricklaser LED ring. I haven't printed the stock fan, is it possible to put a standoff under it to use that design?

I don't have the tricklaser LED ring but I did install a 60mm angel-eye LED ring and created the layer fan in this link: http://repables.com/r/729/

It's based on the default layer fan by JJ but it hangs a little lower and shorter to avoid my 60mm LED ring. Maybe it will also work with the tricklaser LED ring (which I think is a 50mm ring).

Thanks - I'll try it.

I use greenhouse tape since I have it. I also have used pipe foam. The corner joints aren't structural, so anything that fits for you works.

OK - Wrap Up for our build.
We built the stock kit, but added astrosyn dampers,the tricklaser lightring, and the stock hotend with a cartridge heater and threaded thermistor. We chose red as the accent color on a black kit. Printing the additional parts out of SeeMeCNC Rocket Red ABS and PLA.

Plan from this point includes belt tensioners (anyone have suggestions), Xenocrates / Ma enclosure, and the Octopanel setup for the Octopi printer server. I'm also considering a ducted effector platform (although it may interfere with the lights, which we use to see whats going on.)

This has been a great deal of fun! A few little calibrations still to go.

Thanks for all the advice and support.

I know of two options for belt tensioners:

These printable ones that slip on the upper idler axle and act as positive retention mechanism once it's properly tensioned
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1215340

And ones that go on the belt itself to take up slack.
http://e3d-online.com/Mechanical/Motion ... ing-Spring

Both have some drawbacks, but are reasonable to work with. For instance, the printable ones cannot get you to proper tension on their own, you must adjust them into position. However, the don't potentially damage the teeth on the belt, nor can they be grabbed by other parts of the printer. Pick one you like, and go with it.

And by the way, nice choice of colors. I made the same choice for mine (Although I've been slowly repainting, rather than doing it initially as was a smart plan).

As far as suggestions, I have a few (Being someone who heavily modifies their printer, how could I not)
1. PEI for the bed. Adhesion issues? Warm up time? Warping? Tired of applying adhesion promoters then scraping them off? PEI helps with all of those. It's also fairly easy (See the Windex float method on the forums) and cheap.
2. Heatspreader, Copper or AL. Inconsistent bed temperatures? Wild oscillations? inability to print a full plate? Heatspreaders work for all those cases, and if you get a nice flat one, you can ditch the glass and stick PEI directly to it.
3. Heatsinks on the steppers. 40x40MM heatsinks are pretty cheap and available. Attaching them to the steppers with some thermal paste and a zip-tie/hoseclamp/something is pretty easy. Helps with printing PLA among other things. Especially if you plan on heating the chamber without moving the extruder.

Beyond that, it becomes much more expensive and application specific.
High temps, fast heatup a goal for the bed? 24V PSU for it, and an SSR. Plenty of info on the forums, but it's a mite expensive, and not needed by everyone.
Want to print exotic materials, such as PC, PETG, and carbon fiber filled filaments? An E3D is probably the hotend you want (Another option is the Prometheus), and you'll probably want a good mount to go with it, such as the 713maker mount.
Want the king of filament drivers (Extruders, not hotends), with enough torque to ram a filament through a brick wall (Metaphorically speaking)? The Bondtech QR is your friend, and has a drop in replacement mount for the Max.
Heated chamber getting to be too warm for good part cooling? The Berd air works (Sorta, mounting it is a real pain. I've had it drop down into prints twice so far, and broke one cleaning up after the second time. But I think I have mounting issues mostly licked.), and draws outside air to cool your parts efficiently and controllably.
And then the big one. Electronics and autocalibration. Smoothie? Duet? Wait for the next versions? Try the Replicape and hope it works? FSR? Mechanical probe? IR? Hope for the accelorometer probe to release soon? Hard to say. I haven't made any decisions on that myself as yet (Other than likely not wanting an IR or mechanical probe)

you can try to use the springs from a clothespin to tension your belts also looks just like the ones e3d online sells.

Tom C