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I had thought that MatterControl was at the point where I could finally produce a specific version of the build manual that covered MatterControl instead of Repetier-Host.

Everything was great until I had to cover the slicing process. I wanted to continue to cover Slic3r for the PEEK and layer fan shrouds. Unfortunately, while MC uses the Slic3r engine (which version? There's no way to tell! The Slice Engine dropdown should include the version #.) the way Slic3r manages settings has been left out.

It appears that the Print, Filament and Printer settings have all been quashed into the ambiguously named "Quality" dropdown. Managing the three separate categories of settings that Slic3r uses like this is a mess. I applaud the work you guys have done here, but if you're going to include three different slicing engines, you need to manage their settings like the stand-alone versions do. Right now it's a mess and doesn't make any sense at all from the standpoint of the user.

I'd even be up for fixing this myself, but then I discovered that MatterControl uses some custom widget framework that I've never heard of and can't find any documentation on. I have not the time nor inclination to learn yet another framework, especially when the default .Net/Mono control framework would have been perfectly suitable for this application.

Until the slicer configuration system is cleaned up, there's really no point in me continuing the work on a MC specific version of the build manual. It basically boils down to the fact that if it doesn't make any sense to ME, there's no way in hell I have a chance to explain it to someone that's never used it before.

Right now it appears that "clever" is trumping "usability" and that's a problem.

g.

I totally agree with you Gene.
I really, really want it to work... but the slicer setting are confusing and very difficult to manage.

The custom settings framework is a bit of a PITA to start with but works fairly well when you get your head around it.

The way I look at it is that you have printer settings, all of them in their different filament / print speed / layers / cooling / extruder etc categories in a base configuration and then you can apply three different sets of deltas to those base settings for quality, material and something else.

Yes, they could clean up the ease with which different profiles can be defined and changed because it's annoyingly back-to-front at the moment. But the basic principle of base settings + deltas works pretty well.

I downloaded Mono, Xamarin and the source to try and clean up some of the quirks of their slicer (the MatterSlice program makes some pretty clean gcode, especially compared to Slic3r's dot-to-dot insanity) but once again ran out of time. Haven't looked at the UI yet.

Thanks for the comments guys, the MC dev team is constantly soaking in feedback and trying to address things that are issues and explain the reasoning behind things that are purposeful.

@geneb Before I wax philosophical on why things are the way they are in MC I wanted to mention that we'd be happy to work with you to help translate your current Slic3r .ini's into MatterControl presets that make sense and then prepackage them. Just shoot us an email with the files. Also - feel free to give us a call to discuss.

Some comments:
I think it is important to understand that MatterControl is not meant to be an overlay for Slic3r - MC includes three slice engines (Slic3r, CuraEngine and MatterSlice) so that if one engine doesn't work there are fallback options, but now that MatterSlice is beyond the experimental phase it is our recommended (and default) slicing engine. The arrangement and approach to slice settings stems from the desire for interoperability between engines and an ultimate goal of having presets be the dominant way for people to adjust settings (ie 95% of the time, a combo of Quality/Material presets should get you what you want).

The presets are first and foremost meant to 'ship' with the printer so that each model comes with useful presets that are preloaded and selectable. As an editable tool they are really meant for super-users and to that end not constraining them to a specific subset of settings was intentional, done to provide maximum flexibility; that way an 'ABS' preset could include not just overrides for temperature, but for settings such as speed, which in Slic3r is a print setting, separate from material. When users can select or, as a fallback, import great presets it makes a world of difference in the learning curve. All that said, I realize that presets in their current form aren't close to perfect - and there are definitely some planned improvements on the way.

We have a saying internally which is that 'familiarity trumps usability, at least for a while'. To illustrate what I mean by this - just this morning I was at a hands-on 3D printing workshop session with about thirty K thru 12 teachers and the only person having much trouble was actually one of the more experienced who had been using RepHost - he was used to the RH design paradigm and had preconceptions about how things should work. We hope you'll bear with us as we try some different approaches with an eye on improving things. The SeeMe forum in particular has been a great resource for extremely informed MC feedback and input so please keep it coming.

Thanks for the quick response Kevin.

I just downloaded the 1.1.2 build off the SeeMeCNC website and there doesn't appear to be any profiles shipped with it. Can you cook those profiles into the installer? It would be simpler from the user's standpoint if all they needed to do was to create a material profile for the filament they have on hand (primarily naming it by color and putting the averaged filament diameter in). They could then select the heat/feed profile they need (ABS, PLA or T-GLASE in this case) and then slice.

If those profiles are in the distribution, the user can skip the whole download/import process.

I tried building the github version (VS2k12, Ult. ed.) and it blows up - Lars suggested I try the development branch, but I've not had the time yet. (I've got so many irons in the fire that it's hard to find an open space big enough to add fuel! )

Once I get past the slicing section, I'm going to want to do a "full" user guide chapter like I did for Rep host. Are you guys planning on any future changes that would quickly obsolete that guide? If so, I'll hold off on that bit for a while.

BTW, can you add a "clear" button to the serial terminal and also allow select/copy in the output window? I was going to do that myself before I discovered the whole custom widget framework thing.

g.

Yes - we can cook those profiles in no problem. The more the better. They will be loaded after the user selects the model.

Most of the planned updates won't affect the core functionality much; the possible exception is the Library which is getting a major overhaul that will include optional cloud syncing.

Here's a shortlist of major changes that are current scheduled:
Cloud library
Multi-extrusion support
X3G support
Embedded repair tool

Can do on the terminal changes - it's also slated for a bit of an overhaul. In addition to the changes you mentioned it needs persistence, scrolling and and option to export to file.

I'll sit on the manual update then.

Thanks Kevin.

g.

Matter control is not taking advantage of the extra cores in the CPU. Repetier seems to be using 7 of my cores where as MatterControl only uses about 1.5 of them. (On mac os X)


Matter control still gets the job done faster though

WHen i use matter control on the mac, i have to wait a certain time before putting the file to the SD card. As it takes some time for the g code to be generated. However i do not see a clear indication when the generation is finished. I remember seeing that it was exporting but on my latest exports i failed to see it.

Ejecting the SD card before matter control has finished end wiht a non working g code and the printer does not start the print.

The way i overcome this is, i have my activity monitor running and i have a look when the CPU% drops indicating that MC is not working anymore.

Then i remove the sd card. Another option would be to export to your hard drive, and while you are fumbling in finding your sd card etc it will have finished, and then you copy from the HD to the SD card.


So, if you are getting problems with exporting to your SD card from MC, and when you plug the SD card in to your printer it beeps and does not start printing (displaying something with a -1 at the end), this procedure might sole your problem.

I had MatterControl keep crashing on me when slicing the Marvin file from 3D Hubs. Works well with other other files.

I'm liking the interface so far after I figured a few things out. Instructions on the website could be a little more in depth, but well written for whats there. It will take some time to get the presets I want setup correctly, but it should work nicely once they are.

Heating of the bed and hot end seem to take longer in MatterSlicer, compared to Cura and and Slic3r in Repetier. Would like like both of them to heat at the same time and reach set temps at the same time.

The slicer has nothing to do with the heating speed of the hotend or heated bed. Nor does the host software for that matter.

g.

geneb wrote:The slicer has nothing to do with the heating speed of the hotend or heated bed. Nor does the host software for that matter.

g.

I'm not taking about the slicer heating the hot end and bed. There has to be some kind of software that controls the order of the heating for the hotend and bed.

To simplify, why does,

Slic3r in Repetier heat the bed and hot end at the sametime,

Cura in Repetier heats the hot end first then the bed, and

MatterSlicer in MatterControl heats the bed first then the hotend?

Parallel heating may be faster but you will get a bit more ooze out of the nozzle.

teoman wrote:Parallel heating may be faster but you will get a bit more ooze out of the nozzle.

Agreed, but I babysit the machine until the first layer is done any way, I'll be cleaning up the ooze either way. The skirt/brim with the refill the nozzle before getting the part. Until nozzle wiper/cleaners become standard, you're babysitting the machine until the first layer.

Something in the different softwares is causing the ordering of the heating of the hotend and bed.

Since you are baby sitting the printer, you can manually adjust the temperature from the LCD. That is what i do.

And I do that some of the time. But I'm not going to let it sit there warmed up while I still messing with the slicer. I only pre-heat if I have something ready to go.

BONE wrote:MatterSlicer in MatterControl heats the bed first then the hotend?

I've never noticed it because I don't rely on the sliced g-code to do the preheat, I use the control panel on the host software or the LCD. I want it up to temperature, the bed heat soaked and the nozzle primed before I get near a print job. I use the time to do a slice and preview the layers to make sure it ain't going to do anything silly when I hit the print button.

Captain Starfish wrote: I've never noticed it because I don't rely on the sliced g-code to do the preheat, I use the control panel on the host software or the LCD. I want it up to temperature, the bed heat soaked and the nozzle primed before I get near a print job. I use the time to do a slice and preview the layers to make sure it ain't going to do anything silly when I hit the print button.

That's what I've been doing too. Then I give the nozzle a wipe and hit Start. I'd like it if MatterControl would ring a bell when everything was up to temp, but usually I'm messing with the slicer for longer than that anyhow.

OK, had some issues with MatterControl last night.

The part I was working on, I had scaled up 1.5 times two days ago in MatterControl. It appears that in saved the scaling back to the original file I was working with. I had another copy of the same file and confirmed by noting the file size had gone from 600Kb to 2400kB.

Could not generate G-code in either MatterSlicer or Cura. Would get to around 80% and either fail and crash, return a blank slice, or show some kind of broken sliced G-code half way on the display bed.

I tried uninstalling MatterControl version and reinstalling with the SeeMeCNC version. Opening the SeeMeCNC version for the first time, had the same file load and all my settings. Slicing did not work.

I had high hopes for this one. If anyone has any thoughts or can help, that be great. I'll be moving onto S3D soon otherwise.

My only thought on the slicer is to try the "Repair" settings and see if they make a difference.

But yes, it appears to be as-intended that when you press Save when editing an STL file in MatterControl, you are saving over the original .STL file; when you press Save As, you will save a copy to MatterControl's directory (and optionally also to their "Library"). I get it, but it feels like the user experience there needs a bit more refinement somehow.

I have had trouble getting Slic3r to work at all with MatterControl. If it saves the file, when I print, i can not heat the Hot End or Bed.

Is this a setting, Im missing.

Dan

Doesn't heat for me either. If I have the bed and nozzle pre-heating, it shuts them off.

jdurand wrote:Doesn't heat for me either. If I have the bed and nozzle pre-heating, it shuts them off.

That is exactly what happens to me. As well some times it locks up and I have to disconnect and restart a print.

Dan

Is there a way, besides remembering to disconnect the usb cord, to shut off Mattercontrol's unnecessary need to automatically connect to the printer? When printing off the sd card, it interrupts the printer.

Mac The Knife wrote:Is there a way, besides remembering to disconnect the usb cord, to shut off Mattercontrol's unnecessary need to automatically connect to the printer? When printing off the sd card, it interrupts the printer.

It's a crap fix, but you can disable the auto connect in the printer setup. I say crap because now you have to select the printer every time you "want" to connect. But it's still better than it auto killing something currently printing. ( which I've done several times...)