Welcome to the SeeMeCNC Community

So we're trying to do fast production style runs (making 10 - 20 parts per day) on this Rostock Max v2, and I have a couple questions for the community.

When we first started, we had a lot of curling of parts. So we did 4 things which significantly reduced peeling:

1) Used glue stick as suggested by seemecnc.
2) Covered the whole printer space with clear acrylic to reduce heat loss and allow bed to heat up more (it can now heat to 105, without acrylic cover it got to 90 max).
3) Replaced glass bed with 1/4'' aluminum bed, which really reduced heat variation across the bed itself (glass saw heat variance of 5 degrees from center to outside - aluminum reduced this to 1 degree).
4) added a rim (an extra two passes on the first z-axis layer) to help stabilize the piece.

While this helped, and we can print a single part (same parts as those we sent you), but we're trying to fit 4 such parts on the bed to print at once to increase production speed. That's where, even with our tweaks, we cannot get consistent results - sometimes it works, sometimes it fails. I recognize that we're are trying to do a bit more than the average user.

Some other potentially relevant notes:
1) We are not using a boat... I'm hoping we can avoid it since it adds more post-processing. We are using a rim (2 passes wide) which helps things stick).
2) The bed heat is anywhere from 100 - 105 on the bed when we start.
3) We have a 11'' round bed, with stock heating element.

Also, we're trying not to have to cool the plate every time we take off a part. Initially our production guy was removing the plate, washing off the glue with water which cooled it down, then we'd have to wait 30 minutes for it to heat back up. We just started using a metal scraper which still takes a minute or two but the plate doesn't cool nearly as much. Any suggestions on clean up between quick turnover of parts?

Also, sounds overkill, but I was thinking about getting a copper plate to minimize heat loss. Do you have any ideas or suggestions?

Thanks!

Greg

Try a brim with more passes, if you can fit it. That will really stick your parts down.

Switch to 24V with a DC SSR on your heated bed, and it will heat up much quicker. Almost as quick as your hot end.

A hot air gun or a hairdryer can get most of the heat back on to the plate.

For the other stuff... i am also searching for answers.


Check the thread about the PEI build surface, I ordered one, i do not have it in hand but it looks very promising.

There is also a build plate called the gecko, afaik, no one has it yet but their video seems impressive.

Have you tried painters tape with glue? Just peel the old tape off after each run then retape.

If you make multiple pieces at one time on the bed, you can use your modeling program to combine all of the parts into a single part with a custom "brim" you build into the model.

I've had luck positioning several pieces as if they are on the build plate and then adding a 1mm thick "brim" the floods the entire area covered by the parts and about 15mm beyond the extents of the parts. I also added "breakaway" lines along major parts of each part. These were just a groove in the brim reducing the thickness to 0.5mm where I wanted the snap the brim off the parts.

I also had some good luck by using a much thinner piece of paper to calibrate the Z-height of the extruder. I found that getting the Z a bit closer to the build plate would cause the first layer the extruder put down to be really super thin and the force that it takes to extrude these layers into the small gap under the extruder really presses the plastic into the bed. I think it actually creates a vacuum seal if presses the plastic down so hard. When I peel the part off the bed I get a perfect smooth bottom with almost no extrusion lines visible.
Other than that, you could switch to a plastic that shrinks less and this would result in less curling and hence less peeling.

A way to solve your cold bed issue would be to get a second bed piece.

Step 1: Prepare Bed A for Printing
Step 2: Prepare Bed B for Printing
Step 3: Install Bed A on Printer
Step 4: Start Print of part on Bed A
- - - - -
Step 5: Remove Bed A with finished part
Step 6: Install Bed B on Printer
Step 7: Start Print of part on Bed B
Step 8: De-Part/Clean/Prepare Bed A while Bed B is in use
Step 9: Remove Bed B with finished part
Step 10: Install Bed A on Printer
Step 11: Start Print of part on Bed A
Step 12: De-Part/Clean/Prepare Bed B while Bed A is in use
Step 13: Go To Step 5

You can accelerate the process by putting a hot-plate nearby to preheat the idle bed in as part of your "prepare bed" procedure.

It's a lot easier than it sounds.

Right, but in between each plate swap, they have to re-calibrate the towers due to the slight variances across the build plates.

At least, I find I have to re-calibrate each time I remove and reset my glass plate...

I think you might have some other issue going on, because I have never had to recalibrate after simply removing the glass plate. If that were true, simply washing the plate between prints would be a problem for every person here because I have never seen anyone recalibrate between prints and have never seen it recommended that we index the plate so that it was placed on the heated bed in the same orientation after being removed. Variations in the plate would make indexing a necessity, and that has not been the case.

The OP had mentioned witching to an aluminum build plate, so I would think they could have a pair of plated made with tolerances that would be consistent between builds. At least to the point variations would be negligible to the printer output.

Brian wrote:I think you might have some other issue going on, because I have never had to recalibrate after simply removing the glass plate. If that were true, simply washing the plate between prints would be a problem for every person here because I have never seen anyone recalibrate between prints and have never seen it recommended that we index the plate so that it was placed on the heated bed in the same orientation after being removed. Variations in the plate would make indexing a necessity, and that has not been the case.

The OP had mentioned witching to an aluminum build plate, so I would think they could have a pair of plated made with tolerances that would be consistent between builds. At least to the point variations would be negligible to the printer output.

I just finished putting my Rostock V2 together about a week ago. While installing the glass plate the manual does recommend placing marks on the plate due to the fact that there are slight variations in glass plate height.

So with that being said you might have to recalibrate the printer when glass is removed. The better option would be having maybe two printer profiles. One for plate A and one for Plate B. You could then calibrate the machines once and it should be good.

Ziggey

I 2nd the 24 volt bed heat, you only wait a few minutes, and a top cover like a piece of wool or a towel will help it heat even faster.

also run a single part, and tweak EVERY parameter dealing with print speed and quality, when you have it aced, save the presets using the filament color brand and the part you are making.

after that any incremental tweaks you can make do not save them until after a part is run. with production manufacturing of any kind, documentation will save you thousands of dollars in the end.

you need spares for your printer..... spares of everything, if you do not want to be down for days. remember 2 is 1 and 1 is none...... spares spares spares....


1- nozzles
2- Bowden tubes
3- filament
4- hobbed gear for the extruder
5- belt
6- plastic covers for the cheapskate bearings

any wear items have spares.....


if you are really doing production runs you will need to upgrade to tricklaser parts at some point in time. that and a makerhive yellowjacket board.

Tom C

In case it helps anyone, here's what I've noticed about the borosilicate glass plates.
(I've been through several already)

Each plate is a slightly different height, and that has to be accounted for if you're swapping plates.

Also as mentioned by Ziggey, I also carve out a notch out the top of one side with a file, and that corner always aligns with a specific screw hole when clipping on the glass.

Is this a place for PEI and a blast of compressed air to cool and lift the part? I have had virtually no lifting off the bed with PEI.

Addendum:

I have used PEI from the git-go and have and as noted very little lifting (especially with my enclosure). A blast of compressed gas (i.e. keyboard cleaner) on a hot bed and the part pops off easily.

I have often done this when a print has finished...... kept the bed and HotEnd hot and at print temperature. Blasted the newly finish part with this cold air, poped off the part and washed the PEI with isopropyl EtOH and immediately printed again. I don't like the waiting the bed warm up time!!!

You are correct PEI is in demand and a couple of months ago I ordered a spare PEI and glass plate such that I don't have to wait weeks for a new one when needed (when my PEI gives out........ which is going strong as I approach 1000 hours of printing).

Of note, recently I have noticed a bit of variation in my print bed and have recognized that this is due to my initial "trying to pry, torque or twist off a print" from PEI surface before it is cool. What I have noticed is that now my first layer of my prints are "thin in the areas that I have lifted, twisted and torqued" my pieces. I suspect I am actually lifting the PEI when at 95-100 degrees C and sucking some of the TapeCase 468MP adhesive and creating a bit of an elevation in the bed layer at that "tension point". Thus, if the PEI is hot, don't force it or you will distort the surface of your PEI print surface!!!

In short, do not torqued or pull on a finished print. When a print is cool it simply pops off of PEI. Or use compressed gas to pop it off.